The lease agreeent signed by the Keith Mitchell-led New National Party (NNP) government with the tenants of the Grenada Trade Center at Grand Anse and the Cafeteria at the Ministerial Complex dominated the latest report from the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) of the House of Representatives.

The opposition-dominated committee was given the responsibility by Parliament State. The PAC report was recently laid in Parliament and last week GRENADA TODAY focused on the contents of the report in which Accountant-General, Patricia Antoine-Clyne was giving evidence before the body.

Following is Part 2 of the report in which Antoine-Clyne was being interviewed by Opposition members, Tillman Thomas, Nazim Buke and Glynis Roberts:

She (The Accountant-General) went on to say that she will be going to retrieve that arrangement and be clearer on what has been put down.

She further sated that what has been transpiring, is that Government has been paying the utilities. The Accountant General said that this should not come to her ordinarily. She said that the request for payment should go to the Ministries, directly, where the Permanent Secretaries, as Accounting Officers, must verify the transactions, certify them and forward them to the Treasury.

She said that, if there are cases where Ministries cannot find bills or some disarray or so, as Accountant General, she may be called upon directly, which she has done on occasion.

She gave an example with the provider of fuel right now; Mr. Otway, who has problems in getting payments. She said that she as Accountant General would have to step in so that she could be shown the duplicate bills.

She said that she would verify and authorise payment, because he is threatening to stop give fuel. She went on to state further that she would not want to embarrass the Government.

She also said that she would not want for the Government to want to have use of the Trade Centre at any time and based on the circumstances or carelessness with any Ministry that they are prevented or embarrassed.

The Chairman interrupted and said that there was a fundamental difference between the two, because the building is Government¹s building. The Accountant General said that is why it is so important to have an agreement. She said that although it¹s the Government¹s building, the government is not entitled to just step in if it has passed on ownership or temporary occupancy to someone else, by whatever lease arrangement.

Honourable V. Nazim Burke reminded the Accountant General that the lease arrangement should be legal and she agreed. The Chairman said that the occupant may be a squatter and inquired as to who was the architect of the arrangement.

The Accountant General said that she cannot say that the occupant is a squatter, which is why she needs to get the document, if there is.
She said that she had asked Mr. Bedeau directly if there has been a lease arrangement and he told her there was one. The Chairman inquired further as to the architect of the arrangement and the Accountant General said that she did not know who the architect was.

The Chairman further stated that somebody in the Government should know this and said that he found it strange. Honourable Glynis Roberts inquired if the Trade Centre falls under the Ministry of Works.

The Accountant General said that the Trade Centre was built for the purpose of Trade Exhibitions and so on, so it would have to be under the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. She also said that at one point in time it was under the Ministry of Finance.

Honourable Glynis Roberts asked the Accountant General who gave the occupant permission to go to the Trade Centre and the Accountant General said that the Permanent Secretary/Finance, might have been the one to give permission.

She further stated that she needs to find the document, which she understands may be in their files, but she will have to probe deeper.
Honourable V. Nazim Burke said that one of the concerns that he has, is that while the Accountant General may not want to embarrass the Government or the tenant; she may end up embarrassing herself.

He went on to say that, as Accountant General, ultimately, she is going to have to ask the hard questions of these folks. He said that she will have to insist that certain standards be kept, that certain things be responsible.

The Accountant General agreed fully with the Member. Honourable V. Nazim Burke gave an example of a situation where somebody says, they¹re a tenant of Government property, and no lease has been seen, but the Accountant General can make a confirmation, but no monies are being paid, so Government is not getting any money for it.

He continued by saying that the tenant then turns around and says, that the bills are his, pays them and then they are paid. He further stated that it wasn¹t thought through that since the tenant owes the Government one hundred dollars and the Government owes the tenant one hundred dollars, it could be set off, so that both parties are even.

He continued the example by saying that there is no idea whether any monies are due and payable pursuant to a lease document or any other instrument and that there is no indication from anybody from the Government side that there exists an arrangement that allows this person to lawfully enter and remain upon the premises; the person comes to you and says, pay me some money and then you pay some money.

The Accountant General said that no, this is not what happens, and informed d the committee that the last payment made was from a Cabinet conclusion. Honourable V. Nazim Burke inquired if the document that she heard about was a Cabinet Conclusion.

The Director of Audit said that a couple months ago the gentlemen who operates the Trade Centre called him and it was pertaining to the very said paragraph in the Audit Report, which was being dealt with, and told him that he could get in touch with Nordica Mc Intyre; PS in Legal Affairs and she would supply me with a copy of that agreement, if he so wishes.

He said that he thanked him for shedding some light on the matter, but he never followed it up. Honourable Glynis Roberts asked the Accountant General, if she had assigned an Officer, or if she thinks there is the need to assign an Officer from her Ministry to deal with this problem.

She went on to say that this has been almost six years and it must be known how that agreement can be found, so that the adequate revenue could be collected to maintain the property before it falls right apart, which is all the country has at the present time.

She also sought to find out what arrangements there were before Ivan, in terms of the utilities with the Government and the tenant. The Accountant General said that there are issues with the whole arrangement and she takes responsibility and would delve into the whole thing herself.

She said that if she needs any assistance she will get the assistance of her staff as usual. The Chairman requested from the Accountant General a copy of the agreement and the total amount of monies that have been paid to the occupant of that building, over the period. He further inquired if all payments were made by Cabinet Conclusion.

The Accountant General said that the last payment was the only one she had. The Accountant General inquired as to the period of time being looked at for the information on the payment due and the Chairman said from the time the occupant has been there.

He said that he would like to know what amount of money has been paid to the occupant and whether anything was paid to the Government at all by the occupant.

Honourable V Nazim Burke said that they recognise the difficulties, and reassured the Accountant General that they are not trying to put pressure on her. He suggested to the Accountant General to give the Committee some sense as to the timeframe in which she can come up with information needed.

The Accountant General said that based on the fact that she is supposed to be traveling this Wednesday, until Easter, the information could be had the week after Easter. The Chairman asked the Accountant General if she had a Deputy who could follow up on the case while she is out of the Island and she said that she has a Deputy who can do so, but she would like to deal with that matter, personally.

Reference was made to the Police Garage and it was requested that the Accountant General do an investigation on it. The Chairman went on to say that something is fundamentally wrong and said that as Accountant General, she should find that alarming.

The Accountant General said that even if she does, she has no place to question Government¹s policies, which the Committee accepted. Honourable V. Nazim Burke said that a contradiction may arise from what is said in the section and that if that section is looked at, as an ordinary person, you may come away confused, which is what will trigger an investigation by the Accountant General.
The Accountant General said not necessarily, because the role that a politician plays is different from the one that a technocrat has to play.

The Accountant General said that we may do what we want to, but the fact is as long as Government is not straying from an arrangement or a decision, whatever decision that has been made has to be followed.

Honourable V. Nazim Burke said that was accepted, completely. He went on to say that having read the statement and assuming it to be true, how is it that the Accountant General determines what someone is supposed to be paying.

The Accountant General commented a little bit on the confusion and said that for something like that happening, the dates when the particular decisions may have been taken would have to be looked at.

She said that the Permanent Secretary might have taken that decision and his decision might have been taken unilaterally. She further stated that if Cabinet subsequently takes a decision; it may override that of the Permanent Secretary¹s decision.

Honourable V. Nazim Burke asked the Accountant General to make some investigation to see where she can gather supporting documentation, in respect of the letter from the Permanent Secretary, Works and the Cabinet Conclusions that are referred to at section 7.07.

He further requested a copy of the lease, if it exists and any subsequent conclusions that may have been issued by the Cabinet, but which are not referred to in the Report, and any subsequent leases or other documents that may have been entered into, so that some determination can be had.

He said that the object of the inquiry, first of all, is to determine whether there is a valid lease in place for that property, and secondly, to find out what amounts of monies the person is required to pay by law and thirdly, whether and to what extent that person is complying with the terms of the lease.

The Accountant General agreed to provide the information on what was requested. The Chairman inquired of the Accountant General about the situation with the Ministerial Cafeteria.

The Accountant General said that she had written on that matter and got no response. When asked if she knew the nature of the occupancy at the complex cafeteria, the Accountant General said that she did not know.

Honourable V. Nazim Burke asked the Accountant General what she does in a situation like that, where she sees Government property being used and not having any evidence that monies are coming in on it.

He further asked the Accountant General what she does when she requests clarification on such a matter and receives no response. The Accountant General said that what she would hope to get is a professional response on whatever exists. She said that if she doesn¹t get it there is hardly anything that she could do.